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RE: st: 3 Level - LMM - Number of clusters?

From   "Lachenbruch, Peter" <>
To   <>
Subject   RE: st: 3 Level - LMM - Number of clusters?
Date   Wed, 25 Jun 2008 08:15:24 -0700

Is there a problem with multi-national firms and conglomerates that have interests in multiple industries?  I could see assigning a multi-national to the country of its main offices, but I don't see a way around the multiple industry problem.


Peter A. Lachenbruch
Department of Public Health
Oregon State University
Corvallis, OR 97330
Phone: 541-737-3832
FAX: 541-737-4001

-----Original Message-----
From: [] On Behalf Of Christian Weiß
Sent: Wednesday, June 25, 2008 2:21 AM
Subject: AW: st: 3 Level - LMM - Number of clusters?

Dear Steven,

It's almost as you described in "B".

Firms are nested within in industries
& Industries are nested within countries.

You are definitely right that SIC codes are not country specific. However, the data I am analyzing do take country differences of industries into account, so there is no problem at this point.

At this point, the key question is whether there might be a problem with the number of clusters I am trying model. (2000 firms, 11 countries, 9 (or 69) industries).

Best regards
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: [] Im Auftrag von Steven Samuels
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 25. Juni 2008 03:41
Betreff: Re: st: 3 Level - LMM - Number of clusters?

Do you mean:
1. countries are nested within industries
2. firms are nested within countries?

This doesn't seem right to m
1. industries are nested within countries
2. firms are nested within industries.

In fact, neither A nor B seems right to me, as SIC codes are not
unique to countries nor countries to SIC codes.

Please clarify the structure of your problem.

On Jun 24, 2008, at 12:04 PM, Christian Weiß wrote:

> Hello!
>  I am currently trying to bugfix a linear mix model. My sample
> comprises about 2000 observations (firms) which are nested as follows:
> Level  1:  nested in 9 industries (1 Digit SIC Code) or(!)  68
> industries (2 digit SIC code)
> Level 2:   nested in  11 countries
> Most of the modeled effects will be random.
> Is it possible, that the number of industries /  countries causes
> my model not to converge? (I somehow recall having read that about
> 20 clusters should be used?)

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